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 Moderated by: bartmanaz Page:    1  2  Next Page Last Page  
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Catching fish of all kinds to eat and dive deeper than 130ft  Rate Topic 
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 Posted: Tue Nov 10th, 2009 06:25 pm
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Aquademia
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Mana: 
Hello, I was wondering if you all can write a little bit of what is your input for the following question.


Last edited on Thu Nov 12th, 2009 02:40 am by Aquademia

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 Posted: Wed Nov 11th, 2009 01:29 am
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peacemakers
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I agree, scuba should be about enjoying the environment, photography, and helping preserve.  Free Divers that hunt at 100' plus, deserve all they can get!  

Last edited on Wed Nov 11th, 2009 01:29 am by peacemakers

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 Posted: Thu Nov 12th, 2009 02:13 am
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Vince Radice
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What about all the commercial divers out of Guaymas? And just out of curiosity what does diving below 130 feet have to do with anything, most sea life is found in the shallower depths of water.

 

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 Posted: Fri Nov 13th, 2009 01:36 am
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Panga68
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That's were all the scallops are;).  If its for your consumption I don't see a problem as long as you are not killing everything and anything.  Diving is about freedom and can be enjoyed by all, wether you like to dive deep or stay in the shallow.  Think about it the next time you are in your favorite restaurant eating FISH that was KILLED by someone else. O and please don't eat red meat so all the cows will live happily ever after.:shock: 

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 Posted: Fri Nov 13th, 2009 11:01 am
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ezmony
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Think about what San Pedro Nolasco looked  like 25 years ago......well let me tell you---it was a totally different landscape, in both faun and flora.

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 Posted: Fri Nov 13th, 2009 05:50 pm
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Vince Radice
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For everyones information Mexican fishing law states that you are not allowed to use a compressor or scuba tanks when you dive commerically for octopus scallops, clams lobsters, ect......

As you all know that law, just like Article 68 that protects sport fishing species such as dorado is never enforced here in Sonora or the greater Gulf.

What is needed are core zones of protection that commercial hoocha divers should not be allowed to harvest in.

I have been thinking about starting an NGO for the area that would work for this purpose, local state marine parks, a concept that simply doesnt exist here.

There are ANPs or Areas Naturales Protegidas such as the Estero del Soldado but there is no funding to manage the areas.

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 Posted: Fri Nov 13th, 2009 09:49 pm
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UsryTregre
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Aquademia wrote: Hello, I was wondering if you all can write a little bit of what is your input for the following question.




What is the question? 

Vince:  What is an NGO?

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 Posted: Fri Nov 13th, 2009 11:19 pm
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Vince Radice
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That is weird part of the original post seems to be gone, the question was regarding divers collecting sea food at deep depths, deeper than 130 feet.

NGO= non governmental organization

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 Posted: Sat Nov 14th, 2009 01:04 am
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UsryTregre
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Oh . .  thanks . . .  maybe the Original Poster changed his mind? 

 

 

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 Posted: Sat Nov 14th, 2009 01:48 am
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Vince Radice
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No that doesn´t make sense, once a post is made only the administrator can edit it and the post was not controversial in any way so I doubt Bart edited it. Some kind of server Glitch perhaps or a ghost in the machine.

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 Posted: Sat Nov 14th, 2009 02:02 am
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Panga68
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maybe it went down to deep (past 130) and got bent.:P

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 Posted: Sat Nov 14th, 2009 02:47 am
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Vince Radice
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Perhaps to rapid the ascent,  air embolism on the way up, fizzed like a shaken pepsi bottle and sunk back to be devoured by the denizens of the deep.

More likely, drank to much booze the night before and Dove really deep, nitrogen narcosis takes over and it just kept going downnnnnnnnnnnnnnn, it does feel so good all that nitrogen, nothing better for a hangover.


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 Posted: Sat Nov 14th, 2009 11:44 am
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UsryTregre
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Vince Radice wrote: No that doesn´t make sense, once a post is made only the administrator can edit it and the post was not controversial in any way so I doubt Bart edited it. Some kind of server Glitch perhaps or a ghost in the machine.

? ? I have an edit button on my posts . . . .

I didn't know you could get narc'd free-diving . . .  you guys pulling my leg?

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 Posted: Sat Nov 14th, 2009 10:35 pm
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Biscuit
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Vince, there are a few preservation projects around but I'll have to look them up to get the names right. Tucson dive groups have been doing population evals for at least 30 years, as has the oceonagraphy staff at U of A. Don Thompson has spent his life studying the nearly-extinct Vaquita and it's habitat, and an intl Billfish Preservation org operates in the lower Sea of Cortez. They'd come north if there was enough interest in habitat preservation. Let's see... there's also an oarfish population and preservation movement in the upper reaches, and probably a few others I can't think of at the moment. In the early 90s the AZ-Sonora Desert Museum tried to start a pretection project in the SC area but it never got off the ground. I was involved in that one but we divers couldn't convince ASDM that experienced divers were needed so that the areas wouldn't be damaged by carelessness such as finning as we wroked. I think there's still a project to preserve the San Pedro Iguana population too. None of the existing projects I've mentioned are very well-known but they do claim that the Mexican govt is onboard.

Last edited on Sun Nov 15th, 2009 12:18 am by bartmanaz

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 Posted: Mon Nov 16th, 2009 02:44 am
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Aquademia
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I want to thank all of you for your replies and opinions on this very touchy subject.

the original blog was based on 2 questions that are compleately separate.

1.- what do you think of recreational divers, diving deeper than 130 feet, just for fun? who is liable here n case of an accident? the boat? the captan? the dive master? the instructor? no one?

2.- where do you stand on the fact of using SCUBA to catch and kill fish, lobster, crab, scaplops etc?

Vince, thanks so much for your reply on the fact that is ILIGAL to use SCUBA. I hope they read this posts.

I do eat fish, but I do follow all the good ethics on diving. not beacuse you will eat the fish it means you can use scuba to kill and catch all kind of animals.

I do imagine that 25 years ago that ocean was rich and amazing, but I do know people that is helping the people that started the killings long time ago, and they just dont learn, its like they want to empty the ocean as fast as possible. anyway, that is just me.

Safe and fun dive to all of you.

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 Posted: Wed Nov 18th, 2009 01:35 pm
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UsryTregre
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Vince - I am confused -

You said that scuba cannot be used for commerical fishing.  Scuba divers can spear for their own take, if they have a license, correct?

As for the free divers - their depth is their choosing, and therefore no one at fault but themselves.

 

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 Posted: Thu Nov 19th, 2009 12:39 am
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bartmanaz
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See the fishing regs page on the main web site.  You can't spear fish with scuba gear (free dive only) and cannot take any shellfish w/o a commercial permit.

Bart

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 Posted: Sat Nov 21st, 2009 07:41 pm
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ACWAMAN
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Aquademia,

Think Bart addressed the fishing regulations, so will let that topic alone.

Regarding the 130' plus diving question and who is liable.

With the proper training and equipment, I believe "some" recreational Scuba divers can exceed 130' safely, and has been becoming more common, with the increasing popularity of technical diving over the past 10 years or so.

I think it is the responsibility of the TEK Instructor to advise against participating in the field, to those whom are just not cut out for it, for whatever reason that may be. Just as an Open Water Instructor may have to tell a potential student that can't swim and is scared of the water, that perhaps he or she should consider golf instead.

Beyond the proper training and equipment, there is of course inherent risks when diving any depths, and at some point, I believe that becomes the responsibility of the individual whom willingly participates.

Legal liability, is a different story, as the legal system in the US at least, does not accept any responsibility for the client getting injured. Even when spilling hot coffee on one self, it is somehow the fault of the establishment serving the coffee.

However, as I can't solve the legal system, I will advise any Instructor, Open Water or TEK, to follow the Standards outlined by whatever training organisation they certify through. In some cases these standards might have had no relevance to an incident, but regardless, will effect the outcome.

Following standards will also ensure that the insurance company pays to defend you in the case of an incident, pay out whatever fault the plaintiff might be awarded and protect you personally from any liable claims.

Signing of liability releases is also becoming more effective against being sued, so don't forget to get them signed.

Bottom line, if you don't think recreational divers should be going beyond 130' and would not feel comfortable taking anybody that deep, don't do it. I certainly would not criticize any Instructor for teaching within their comfort zone, I would commend it!

PS - I currently work and have worked in the diving industry for 25 years, and am an active IT with several agencies, including TEK diving.

Regards

Seamus

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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 Posted: Wed Dec 2nd, 2009 04:19 pm
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mmaarrzz
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1.  I have gone after fish to depths greater than 130' - I dive solo but I am trained and take the proper precautions to make safe dives.  I eat all the fish I catch and I only shoot fish that I want to eat.  Diving deep is the divers responsibility - Captains that I have spoken to in the past who wish to control the depth of the divers normally just go to shallow dive sites. 

2.  I don't have any problem with taking game while on Scuba although it IS illegal in Mexico to take ANY game on SCUBA.  What blows my mind is that Mexico would keep this ridiculous (seldom enforced) rule on the books but allow the locals to completely decimate the local waters.  I have been through areas around San Carlos that have been stripped of everything from fish, lobster, mussels, etc. - I hardly think scuba diving spearo's would have anywhere near the impact as the commercial fishermen.  Check out the "new" national parks around Loreto if you want to see the difference between the commercially fished areas vs natural habitat - its like night and day.

I'm curious to know if you think that fish KILL other fish or is it just humans that kill things?;)






Aquademia wrote:
I want to thank all of you for your replies and opinions on this very touchy subject.

the original blog was based on 2 questions that are compleately separate.

1.- what do you think of recreational divers, diving deeper than 130 feet, just for fun? who is liable here n case of an accident? the boat? the captan? the dive master? the instructor? no one?

2.- where do you stand on the fact of using SCUBA to catch and kill fish, lobster, crab, scaplops etc?

Vince, thanks so much for your reply on the fact that is ILIGAL to use SCUBA. I hope they read this posts.

I do eat fish, but I do follow all the good ethics on diving. not beacuse you will eat the fish it means you can use scuba to kill and catch all kind of animals.

I do imagine that 25 years ago that ocean was rich and amazing, but I do know people that is helping the people that started the killings long time ago, and they just dont learn, its like they want to empty the ocean as fast as possible. anyway, that is just me.

Safe and fun dive to all of you.

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 Posted: Sat Aug 27th, 2016 03:21 am
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AKsailor
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1. Been below 130 twice -- once w/ friend who didn't get narc'ed in DiveMaster class, wanted to try harder(?!?) - and it is usually empty and boring below about 80 except wrecks or game. Laws aside, sport divers take game a lot more selectively than commercial divers... let alone "draggers".
2. Vaquitas apparently are being poached to extinction for Asian aphrodisiac market. Viva ignorance!
3. Laws and boundaries are everywhere on every subject, but lack of funding for enforcement just breeds scofflaws.
4. More people turning to NGO's for targeted response, but without authority backing them, see #3.

Still, Mexico is trying and getting better; I just hope it's not too late. Doing the right thing is usually one luxury that goes away in hard times.

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